Toxic Boss Almost Broke Her. She Leads With Joy Anyway. | Sheryl Raphael Whitaker

Transcript: Beat Burnout. Lead With Joy. | Sheryl Raphael Whitaker

[Sheryl]

I get a lot of questions about, because I talk about joy all the time, they ask, “What does joy mean to you?” Ultimately its being in alignment and integrity with myself, regardless of the weather, especially when things are hard.

[Roger]

Your joy never truly disappears, but it can go into hiding. Especially at work, and especially now when so many people are showing up dysregulated by everything going on in the world. 

As a leader or a coach, however, your authenticity and your joy are what make you who you are, and they are key ingredients to how you show up and positively impact others.

But while so many hide their joy, are you able to keep leading with it?

Welcome to What Do You Know To Be True? This is where we explore our superpowers and what it takes to become more of our possible selves. I’m your host, Roger Kastner.

In today’s conversation, I’m joined by founder, host and author, Sheryl Raphael Whitaker, and she shares how to recognize when others are trying to get you to hide your joy. How to embrace and lead with your authentic self. And what to do to ensure you don’t fall back into the trap of hiding your joy again

I’m glad you’re here. Let’s dive in.

Hey, Sheryl, thank you for joining me today. It's a joy to be together. 

[Sheryl]

Hi, Roger. Thank you so much for having me here. I am absolutely thrilled and looking forward to this conversation.

[Roger]

And I'm excited to learn more about your superpower of a genuine love of people and get to know you better. But before we get too far, what's important for us to know about you?

[Sheryl]

I'm a leadership strategist, transformation expert, coach, executive coach, speaker, author. I have a morning show now. I mean, I'm doing things that if you asked me about this a year ago, I would say, who are you talking about?

That is definitely not me. This is really interesting. I've been out of corporate.

Now I'm a corporate escapee for the last almost two years now, actually just had an anniversary. I lean very heavily on the notion that joy is an operating system. And I say that joy is my chief operating officer.

It runs my life, whether things are good or bad.

[Roger]

I'm really excited to learn more about that because I think joy is something that people either write off as being, you know, they get confused with happiness. Yes. Or it feels elusive right now, or they're putting it off for later.

[Sheryl]

Yes. Yeah. A hundred percent.

I get a lot of questions about, because I talk about joy all the time, that they ask me like, well, what does joy mean to you? What is your definition of joy? Ultimately it's being in an alignment and integrity with myself, regardless of the weather, especially when things are hard.

So it's at that foundational, like a peace and integrity that sits with inside, deep within inside yourself and myself.

[Roger]

I love the idea that it's again, part of that operating system, the alignment with your values and your purpose. You wrote the book, It Starts With Joy. And as you just mentioned, you host the It Starts With Joy morning show on Length In.

You are all about living into our joy, but prior to current, you spent 20 plus years in the insurance industry. I did. Would you be able to connect some dots for me and tell me about that experience about being in insurance and how that helped you come to the conclusion that it starts with joy?

[Sheryl]

Oh, this is not, the whole thing is not a completely joyful story. Yeah. I've actually spent, it's been my whole entire career has been in insurance.

I wouldn't trade it for anything in the world. One of the things I learned very early on in my career is that an insurance organization, any kind of financial institution is a really great place to have a career because there are so many different facets to that organization. I mean, I wanted to be in advertising.

I wanted to, you know, I was a marketing major in college and I thought that's what I was going to do, something sexy and exciting. Insurance ended up being just as interesting. I started out in claims and I found my way into learning and development.

And it was amazing. But along the way, I did bump into a host of characters that were, I'll just call them joy killers. And I talk about it in my book.

There was one particular leader that I had. I called her Janet. We'll just put together every single solitary bad boss you've ever had in your entire career.

And you squished them together into one body. That was Janet. And she was also hurt too.

She was in a spot where she was not being treated correctly. And then she just passed that love, quote unquote, onto those who were supposed to be in her care. And it almost broke me.

I have MS, which is why there's orange everywhere. MS color is orange. And it got me to the point where she made me sick.

She didn't give me MS, but she exacerbated it. My hands shaking in meetings, had trouble with my vision, Sunday scaries that started on Saturday. So going through that experience of working with where my joy was ambushed.

And I'd say that she almost broke me and I almost lost myself. I realized after that experience and going on to some Janet juniors, as my career progressed, that once I got outside and I was on the other side of it, once I left corporate, I realized that, wait a second, my secret sauce was leading from a place of joy. The Janice of the world are not leading from that place.

How do I save the world from Janet? And I realized the way to do that was to get to them, right? There are some leaders who had that joy and lost it, or they never had it.

Some things think is BS. There are some who will never ever get there and that's okay. This is not about them.

But if I can talk about it and get folks to look at leadership from a different perspective, from a place of joy as an infrastructure, as an operating system, perhaps then I can make a real difference in an impact.

[Roger]

Thank you for sharing that. Yeah. I think we all have those kind of tormentors in our lives and there's opportunities for us to learn from it in different ways.

And it's really the choice we get to make. Did you have a leader in your experience that chose joy that was a role model or just something that you discovered on your own and chose on your own?

[Sheryl]

I will say it's probably a combination of the two. I've always been joyful, joyful and happy since I was a little kid. My mom says since I was a baby, she didn't know when I was little in a crib, whether I needed changing, hungry, whatever.

I was just pleasant, right? Smile on my face, natural smiler. That's just how the universe made me.

When I got into leadership, that was always one of my superpowers, was just engaging with people because I love people. And realizing as a leader that work gets done through others. It's not about files and KPIs and all the other metrics and data.

All that is generated by the behavior of the human beings who are in our care. Part of that was myself and how I showed up like truly my authentic self. And the other part where other leaders came in was watching those leaders who got it.

And then also continuing to learn and grow and develop under some incredible leaders in my career who do lead and continue to lead from a place of joy and being inspired by them and knowing that, you know what, this is quite frankly, this is not bullshit. It is a real thing and it leads to some real results.

[Roger]

So there was a natural inclination or drive for love and joy that was within you. And you got to see leaders in front of you either demonstrate, live into their joy and love, or live into the fear and the scarcity.

[Sheryl]

Yes. Yeah. Because you're either leading from fear or you're leading from joy.

Fear-based, joy-based. Those are really the two. And some will say, well, we're somewhere in between.

If you're in between, you're probably leading from fear. Yeah.

[Roger]

My friend, April McCormick, likes to ask the question, are you making decisions out of love or out of fear? And I think love and joy are very close to each other. But you did just mention the difference between joy and happiness.

Would love to hear your thought on the difference between the two.

[Sheryl]

Yeah. It's interesting, Roger, because when I first started just really, really thinking about my point of view on leadership, I remember working with a business coach who I actually, I talk about in the book because I fired him because we just were not aligned. But one of the things that he did do for me was he was pushing me.

He's like, what is the secret sauce? Why do people follow you from organization to organization? Why, why, why?

And finally, I just said, I'm a happy leader. That's why. And then they were like, okay, boom, that's it.

So I sat with happiness for a minute. And then as I started to really think about it, I was like, no, because one, I was afraid to say joy because joy has so many different meanings for different people, right? It's steeped in religion.

People think about joy and it confuses with happiness. For some people, joy is really, really deep. And I was like, it's too deep for people to talk about it with, you know, in the confines of like, in the context of like leadership.

But then I started thinking, I was like, no, because happiness is fleeting. Happiness is circumstantial. Happiness comes and goes.

Joy is the operating system. Happiness is the app. Or like I say these days, now it hit me the other day, it's cloudy here in New Jersey, but joy is the sky.

Sun, blue sky. It's been there all along. You just can't see it because of the clouds.

Happiness is the weather, right? Clouds, it's, you know, fluffy, white clouds, gray cover, whatever. It comes and it goes.

But the sky, that blue sky with the sun shining, no matter what the weather is, that's joy.

[Roger]

I have an affinity for founders that name their company something other than their own name. And, you know, as the founder of Three Blue Pens, of course, my bias is showing you are the founder of Eden Anthony Elite Talent Solutions. Can you tell us a little bit about the name?

[Sheryl]

Eden Anthony is my dad's name. So Eden Anthony Raphael. And he passed away when he was 62.

And it's kind of funny, not haha funny, but interesting how when you were younger, like your parents always seem older, obviously. And so when he passed at 62, it just didn't, it seemed like, wow, too young, but not like, wow, way too young. Now I'm going to be 60 and I'm like, holy smokes, 62 was really, really young.

But he was an entrepreneur, always believed in, you know, working for yourself and that type of work ethic. He was a life insurance agent. So independent contractor forever.

And he had a bunch of different businesses. One of the lies that I told myself when I was in corporate, Roger, was that I did not have an entrepreneurial spirit. I did not believe, I couldn't see.

I mean, like my husband's not an entrepreneur. He's a realtor. My sister's an entrepreneur.

I've grown up around my dad was an entrepreneur. But I said, I need to know where my, I need to know where my paycheck's coming from. I need my bennies.

You know what I mean? I need all that together. And so I told myself a lie for the spirit for entrepreneurship.

And when I really felt in my soul that this was the way to go, I knew that the only name I can give my company was, was my dad's name. It was funny because my sister and I were going back and forth and trying to think of names. She was helping me brainstorm.

And then all of a sudden, like digital, you know, that digital, um, what do you call it? Digital frame, you know, his came up and I said, when I was like, my dad, I said, I bet you'd love it if we named it after you. And then the picture got stuck.

[Roger]

Oh, really?

[Sheryl]

So we're like, okay, he is foot stomping right now. And so that's where it came from. Ian Anthony, my dad's name.

[Roger]

And I love it. That's lovely. When did you discover that what you were telling yourself that you didn't have the entrepreneurial spirit inside you?

When did you discover that was a lie?

[Sheryl]

When I realized that no one ever asked you like, what would you do if you weren't afraid? So when you ask yourself that question and you sit with it and you, and you just allow yourself to be really, really honest about the answer, then, you know, so I have a sticker on my laptop and it's, it says, do it anyway, girl. And I'm always telling my, I'm always telling folks, even when I was in corporate, Hey, you know, what makes you scared?

Oh, well, let me do this, this, and this, but I don't want to do that. And I would say, okay, you're doing that. Oh, I just told you, I don't want to do that.

I'm like, ah, but you're going to learn. You're going to learn. Right.

So I had to do that for myself. When I thought about like, why, why don't you think you have this? Because I have a choice.

I was like, well, I'm afraid. Oh, I'm sorry. That's not a good enough reason.

And now Roger, am I still scared? Yeah, I'm scared. I'm only a year and change into this business.

I don't know what's going to happen. I'm betting on myself. And I would tell you, I'm manifesting, you know, I'm a badass.

Now I'm going to be a bigger badass a year from now. And then another year from that. Right.

But I never want to have that regret. I never want to have that regret. So I'm doing it.

And I have no intention of going back. We're in the boats, burning the boats.

[Roger]

So how did you, how did you discover your superpower of a genuine love of people? You mentioned earlier that it was just part of your disposition from being in the crib, but when did you discover that you had that superpower and it was different than other people?

[Sheryl]

I think it might've been, it was, it was early. It was early, maybe kindergarten or first grade. Like whenever someone like that new kid would come into class, I would be the one to want to like sit with them at lunch, show them where like literally where to sharpen your pencils.

Like those, that kind of thing. It just, it gave me joy in order like helping another person and making sure that they were okay. And that's something that just kind of like transcended.

I mean, I don't know if in the first or second grade that I was like, Hey, you know what, Sheryl, I think you have a real love for people. But I knew even back then that it made me, it gave me joy or in whatever way it was for that young Sheryl to, you know, to meet you and to talk to you and you smile back at me, made me smile on the inside. I knew that from a long, long time ago.

And then the more that I, you know, as I grew up and had other friends, got involved in different things in school, et cetera, there were other things that would, that would bring me joy, but people always brought me the most.

[Roger]

What have you found to be one of the most difficult challenges that you've had with your superpower of a genuine love of people? Oh, because some people are just horrible.

[Sheryl]

Yeah. So what do you do then? Oh, you know what?

It's interesting. There's a quote by Maya Angelou that I had to literally say over and over to myself again and again, to finally listen and do it. When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.

So I, you could show me who you are a 10, like 10 times over Roger. And I'd be like, yeah, but that was just a bad day. Yeah.

But he's got things going on with his family. Yeah. But he was just in the car accident.

There were all these like, yeah, buts. I had to teach myself that no, really the first time. My husband always says, you cannot build character by yourself.

So I know that there are folks in this world who are not my people, but I still need them because they're helping me to learn and to grow and to build my own character. And for that reason, I still love you, but I'm just going to love you from a distance. I don't have to, right?

Just because I'm a people lover, it doesn't mean every single solitary person is going to be good for me. That is still a lesson to be honest, like almost 60 years old. I'm still, I'm learning.

I'm still learning.

[Roger]

Yeah. A couple of things are popping up for me. Like I can be the most blissed out loving person ever.

And then I get in the car. Oh, you're one of those? Well, I don't think, well, we'd have to bring my wife in here to see how much of an obnoxious, aggressive driver I am.

But there is these moments where like you get cut off or someone's doing something. And then all of a sudden it's like, okay, where's this blissful, loving human that I know to be when I'm like at home or at work, but now in the car, things have changed a little bit. That's when I have a hard time.

[Sheryl]

Okay. Okay. So I'm going to tell you a secret.

I'm going to tell you a quick little story. So when I met my husband, we met online, but when I met him, he didn't curse at all. He didn't swear at all.

I swear. But because he wasn't swearing, I was like, Oh damn it. He doesn't swear.

So I gotta like keep it quiet. So we went on like this for like one month, two months, third month. And we were in a car.

I was driving. Somebody cut me off and I dropped a few, let's just call them bombs. Okay.

And he looked at me and he was like, you curse. And I said, Oh, I'm so sorry. But you know, sometimes when I'm driving, you know, this guy was coming off.

He's like, Oh, thank God. He's like, I've been holding it in. He's like, I've been holding it in all this time.

And now we're just been ourselves completely. I understand my friends. Yes.

Driving sometimes the road can make you question your love for people sometimes, or at least a driving skill.

[Roger]

Yeah. And I know it's something I need to work within myself. Cause one, I'm not going to change the city of Seattle drivers.

And two, it is just me. It's my reaction to what's going on in my, the story I'm telling myself and I just need to chill the F out. And yet I, I see that as my, my biggest growth edge.

And so when you mentioned about, yeah, sometimes it's really hard to love other people. Yeah. I, I thought about driving to work.

And the second thing that came up as years ago when I was in a consulting engagement, I'm working for a client and it's just being really, really difficult. And it's, it's kind of like, okay, well, I mean, yeah, you are paying me to show up, but are you really enjoying working together? And so I was talking to my boss about this.

And she tells me a story of her sister is a third grade teacher. She asked her sister, like, how do you deal with those really, really difficult kids that just, you just make every day a challenge. And the sister said, well, this is someone's kid.

And that person loves the snot out of that kid. Literally. And so, yeah.

And so when you're having that difficult emotion, recognizing that as the other person is worthy of love and someone does love them, it's like, okay, we're in this together and we can, we can connect on this vibe of love and this communal wishing the best for everyone. But like, I don't have to be behind them on the road and I don't have to go have dinner with them. Cause as another friend said recently, we're not going to be everyone's cup of tea.

[Sheryl]

No, you're just not. And trust me, I know, I know I am not everybody's cup of tea. There are some people who find me downright annoying.

Like my I was, I've been accused of being, having toxic positivity. Right. And and that is one, I had to like look it up to make sure that I really was understanding it because people throw around words and terminology and don't really know what it means, but I'm not the person to call.

If you want someone to like, you know, go and, you know, key a car with you and slash tires and burn the building down. Don't call me. Don't call me.

But if you want someone to help you talk through why you want to do those things and maybe get you on your other side of it so that you, you know, you put the keys down, then call me.

[Roger]

Yeah. I mean, what, what comes out for me on that one is you're about the solution, not the symptom. Yes.

And keying a car, burning down a building. That's just a symptom.

[Sheryl]

Yeah. And you're not, it doesn't put you, it doesn't put you any closer to your goal. It might feel good in, in a millisecond, but after that you're still, you're still in the same place.

[Roger]

So let's talk about solutions. In an odd way, that's, that's bringing up the distinction between joy and happiness. Like it might make you happy for the moment to burn down a building.

It's not going to be long lasting joy for sure. No, no, it's not.

[Sheryl]

It is not. I love that. That's good.

[Roger]

As someone who has wanted to key a car or burn down a building occasionally. No, I recognize that in myself for sure. We all have that.

[Sheryl]

We all do. Yeah.

[Roger]

So Sheryl, in this moment, what do you know to be true about your superpower of a genuine love of people?

[Sheryl]

I know that, Oh, I'm not going to say a hundred percent all, but I do know that most people are inherently deep down inside good. That we do want the same things. We want to be happy.

We want to be healthy. We want to enjoy our families, all the things that we love in this life. We want to enjoy this life.

I do truly believe that most people are like that, have that. I do know that to be true for me.

[Roger]

I agree. We're so much more similar than differences that get pointed out. Yeah.

[Sheryl]

Yeah, absolutely. We have so much more in common, especially when right now, obviously everybody's talking about AI and I really, people are surprised when they find out that because I love people so much, they're like, how could you possibly love AI so much? Cause I do love AI.

I love it. Well, because no matter how intense AI may get in our future, we are, we are, we are human beings first and foremost, and that is not changing. That is not changing.

And in my mind, the way I look at it, AI is helping. It helps me to focus in and lean more into the human aspect of stuff as it takes some real administrative things off of my plate. So I know that's, that's provocatively debatable, but I find that so many organizations that I'm speaking with are, you know, they're forgetting that fact.

They're forgetting that there's a human behind all of this that's still going to be there and you need to bring them along with you on this journey. You can't leave them behind.

[Roger]

I'm going to bring back the analogy of, you know, taking off in this, in a, in stormy weather and there's going to be some bumps, but you know, once we get above the clouds, it's going to be sunny and smooth sailing. I'm with you. I think it's going to add to how we do our work.

And it's going to take over a lot of those rote tasks that allow us to shine and thrive more. That's going to, it's going to be, it's going to be some bumps to get there. And I don't mean to trivialize, trivialize what it means to be laid off.

I've been there before. And I know exactly, yeah, it sucks. So I'm hopeful as well, but that doesn't mean it's all rainbows and puppies.

[Sheryl]

No, no, no. I read an article the other day and now I can't remember where it was about how some organizations are actually having to like, kind of like do the Michael Jackson moonwalk back on their AI efforts because they like over-indexed, they've gone too far. They're, they are, you know, you have some organizations who are too slow, but you've got some that are moving a little bit too fast.

[Roger]

So what did you believe early on about your superpower that you've come to learn not to be true?

[Sheryl]

I had to really, really understand that not everybody has good intentions. Not everybody has good intentions and not everybody's going to love you back. So I'm out there, you know, I love people and I'm giving, I'm giving it all, giving it all, but recognizing and realizing that not everybody's going to love me back and, and not everybody has my best interests at heart.

And then discernment becomes really important in like, you know, seeing the forest with the trees and like really, truly seeing somebody and, and, and listening to my own head and heart, which are much more in alignment today and more. And so every single solitary day, and not like trying to like fix folks in like, no, no, you really, I'm a great person. You'll see.

Right. I can help you. I can help you see that.

I don't need, I don't do that anymore. I don't, we don't see eye to eye. If my vibe is not your vibe, I'm not trying to convince you.

I just wish you well. And then I move on, you know, move on into sunlight on my own without you and I'm all good. And dude, that feels so good.

I wish I'd done that year ago.

<PASTE>

[Roger]

Yeah, that ability to let go of, I will fix you, or I'm here to fix you. I've, I learned this early on in my consulting career of never working harder than your client. Yeah, and I brought that into coaching.

And now I bring it into relationships where I feel like, okay, if I'm putting in 60%, they're only putting in 40. Well, maybe if I put a little bit more, they'll put a little bit more. And no, now, now I'm doing 70, and they're doing 30.

And it's like, maybe what happens if I pull back? Like, yeah, okay, if I'm doing 40, they're still only doing 30. Maybe they're not that into it as I am.

Like, maybe, maybe we need to have a conversation here and not just a game of read and react.

[Sheryl]

You know, it's so true. I cannot, especially as a coach, I cannot care more about this, whatever this is than you do. That's not how it works.

And coaching is not about fixing anyway. But I'm going to meet you there. I'm going to support you.

But my friend, you got to meet me more than halfway. This is all you.

[Roger]

And it's your, you know, it's your life. So you should be putting into it. And if you're not I'm just wasting my time.

Because you're not committed. You're not willing to do the work. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. I'm with you there.

[Sheryl]

Yeah.

[Roger]

What's next for you and your superpower of a genuine love of people?

[Sheryl]

What is next for me? Oh, this whole thing that I am focused on, Joy, as my chief operating officer, Joy, as an operating system and an infrastructure for leadership, I am doing anything and everything I can to get the message out. And so this year, we're talking about before I'm focusing on doing 100 talks about joy.

It doesn't matter if it's a podcast like this, if it's my own show, or if it's a book event, whatever, doesn't matter. A church doesn't matter. If I'm talking about it, I'm counting it.

And I'm doing this intentionally. That's always my word for the year is intentional, by the way. Trying to be intentional about having these conversations, because I know that's the only way that that it's going to make a difference.

If I sit back and just wait for someone to stumble upon my book on Amazon or something like that, that's like, that's not how it's going to happen. We got to be out there talking about it, and hopefully having an impact and changing. And it stems all out of my love for people, that I want everyone to live and lead from that place, because it feels good.

And it'll make a difference.

[Roger]

I felt that. That's lovely. It's like this thing that's been shown to be true to you.

You want to make sure that people get to see it in the world, so that if they're thinking of choosing it, you're encouraging them to do so.

[Sheryl]

Yes. And it's okay. Have you ever seen that video?

It's like a wide field at a music festival, and it's music playing, nobody's dancing, and this one guy gets up. Have you seen this one? One guy gets up and starts dancing, and then another, then another, then another.

It's just easier. It was easier like that first guy did it, and then a second, and then a third, and everybody, next thing you know, everybody's dancing. That's what I picture when I think about the work that I'm doing.

There are a lot of people talking about Joy Roger, a lot. There are books out there, galore. But no one's talking about it from a leadership perspective, as an operating system, as an infrastructure.

And I don't mind being that dude dancing in the field, I'm just hoping that at some point in time, others are going to get up and dance with me.

[Roger]

Yeah, it's a great video, and I love the title of it. I think it's something, and I'll put in the show notes, I think it's something like, every leader needs a first follower. Yes, I think it is something like that.

Being the role model out there, dancing in the field by yourself, and inviting, just by doing it, you're inviting other people to join.

[Sheryl]

Absolutely. I had this clip from, was it Instagram or LinkedIn? I can't remember now, it might have been Instagram.

No, it was LinkedIn, where this gentleman, his name is Will, he posted a video of, so this airport arrivals. So there were two kids, the kids were dressed up as dinosaurs. Did you see it?

[Roger]

Yeah, yeah.

[Sheryl]

Wait for grandma, then grandma comes out, and he talked about the fact that kindness is a system. He considers himself weird, and his grandma embraced his weird. I mean, but somebody's got to go first, and it's courageous when you do.

Oh my, that's such a great video. I watched it like a hundred times. So cute.

So cute.

[Roger]

Yeah. So Sheryl, speaking of going first, are you willing to go first in the lightning round? Oh yeah, sure.

I don't mind. I don't know what that segue meant, because there's no one else going second. So either you do it or you don't.

So Sheryl, fill in the blank, a genuine love for people is? Is your heart beating on the outside. Love that.

Who in your life provides a genuine love for people for you?

[Sheryl]

My dad. My dad, Aidan Anthony. He absolutely loved people.

[Roger]

Is there a practice or routine that helps you grow, nurture, or renew your ability to have this genuine love for people? No, transcendental meditation, my friend. Is there a book or movie that you recently consumed that you would recommend that has a genuine love for people as a theme?

[Sheryl]

This is not a book or a movie, but everybody loves Raymond. When I watch that show, I mean, and it's going to sound really, really strange, but the underlying foundation for why that family stays together is love and joy. The happiness, that's the sitcom, right?

But what keeps them together, and I love those moments in the show. It's one of my favorite shows.

[Roger]

What is one thing that gets in your way of your superpower of a genuine love of people?

[Sheryl]

Time. Time gets in the way because I really would love more hours in the day so that I can balance what I need to do for building the business with my desire to spend as much time with people as I can, especially those that I love. As you can tell, I'm an extrovert, so I get my energy from others, not from myself.

I don't go within, I go external for energy.

[Roger]

Some of these questions feel so obvious, but I ask them anyway because the response is rarely what I think it's going to be. So with that, the last question, what word or phrase describes what a genuine love of people feels like when it's had a positive impact? The sky.

Yeah. No, that's such a beautiful metaphor. My guess was going to be joy, maybe because it's right here, but...

Joy is the sky.

[Sheryl]

Joy is the sky. I'm going to put it on a mug, a t-shirt or anywhere I can.

[Roger]

But I love how much that superpower feels like it's just fuel to feel joy. It is.

[Sheryl]

If you allow yourself, I find these days, Roger, with everything we've got going on, like the world is heavy right now, but that doesn't mean that you can't lean into what inherently makes us all human. And that is the experience we have and the energy that we bring when we're together. So we can still do this.

[Roger]

Yes, we can. This is why I love editing. I love it.

I hope you keep it in. It might go to the bloopers. But anyway, if an audience member wanted to ask you a question or follow you, where do you want to point them to?

[Sheryl]

Oh, sure. They can find me on LinkedIn, Sheryl Rafferty Whittaker, or they can find me on my book's website. It starts with joy.com.

YouTube, my show, it starts with Joy Live, or just on my website, Eden Anthony Elite Talent Solutions.com.

[Roger]

Love that. Well, Sheryl, this has been everything I was hoping it would be. I love how much you embody joy, how much you embody a genuine love for people.

It comes through. It radiates through. It feels like I'm feeling it, even though we're a few time zones away and doing this over the interwebs.

But I mean, I love the energy you're bringing to this. I love the energy you're bringing to your morning show on LinkedIn. It's just such a pleasure to be witnessing your energy and your joy that you bring to everything you do.

And I love the idea that's just fueled by love. So thank you for being here, and thank you for sharing your wisdom with us.

[Sheryl]

Oh, my goodness. Thank you for having me. This has been awesome.

I was looking forward to it, and it did not disappoint. So appreciate you, Roger. Thank you.

[Roger]

Appreciate you, too. Take care. Bye-bye.

[Sheryl]

Take care.

[Roger]

Thank you all for being in this conversation with us, and thank you, Sheryl, for sharing your experiences with your superpower and how to live our joy out loud especially in the workplace.
 The question I’m asking myself now after the conversation is: Where do I risk encountering a joy vampire, and how can I mitigate those joy-sucking interactions?  

What Do You Know To Be True? is a Three Blue Pens production. I’m your host, Roger Kastner. We are recording on the ancestral lands of the Duwamish and Suquamish people. 

If you want to learn more about showing up authentically, check out this conversation with Dr. Lalith Wijedoru on speaking your truths, or this conversation with Jules Kuroda, on accessing and trusting the innate wisdom already inside of you.

Until next time, be well, my friends, and, love you, mean it!